The goal of the path is to transform your awareness from separation to unity. In unity we perceive only love, express only love, are only love.
- Deepak Chopra, The Path to Love

MH: Hello, Deepak. We're calling you from Northampton, Massachusetts.

DC: Oh, I love that place. I've been to Northampton at least three times, you know, for book signings at Beyond Words. I spent twenty years in Boston, so I used to travel in that area a lot. For some reason I love Northampton.

MH: Yes, the energy is amazing here.

DC: The energy, and the young people. It's a great feeling there, New England with all the seasons. I feel nostalgic! Here I am in California, looking at the ocean, seventy-five degree temperature, and feeling nostalgic about the winter in Northampton.

MH: Why is it that you decided to move?

DC: Initially because I was going to work with a big hospital here, but you know, one thing led to another. I like it here.

MH: What was the transition from being a doctor to also becoming a writer like for you?

DC: I went to medical school because I wanted to be a writer. I was inspired by other physician-writers like Somerset Maugham, and people like Sir Arthur Conan Doyle. You know, a doctor sees all kind of people every day. It's about people, it's about life, it's about death!

MH: The Great Drama.

DC: Melodrama.

MH: Of the several books of your that I've read, Quantum Healing is my favorite. In the book you focus on the conversation between the cells of the body, the mind, and the source of that, which is Consciousness. Would you explain how this process works?

DC: Well, every time you have a thought . . . Think of someone you know. Can you see an image? Can you hear their voice? As soon as you do that-if I were to look inside your brain, and these days we can with all kinds of instruments, I would see a cluster of photons. And then I would see immediately a series of electromagnetic impulses of frequency-coded trains of information racing along cable networks, which are basically neural networks, and then squirts of chemicals called neuropeptides. These chemicals would the float through the rest of your body and hook onto cells in you immune system and everywhere else. So even as you summon forth a thought, you create light out of nothingness. God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. You do that every time you think a thought. Then you convert the light into molecules.

   Where is that thought before you have it? Most people have assumed it's in the brain, but there's no proof of that. In fact, the proof is that they're not in your brain, that they are only actualized in your brain, just like CNN News is not on your TV set, it only actualizes on your TV set.

   So here we are, every thought that we think, we summon forth something from the world of consciousness, where it lies hidden as potential. We convert it into light, we convert it through a series of rapidly changing hyper- and depolarizations and action potentials in the brain. We convert it into information, and from information we convert it into matter! So that's one example.

   You can see that consciousness conceives, constructs, and become matter, not only in your brain but in the rest of your body, and of course through your body you experience the Universe. Before you actually have any perception of the Universe, it too is a radically ambiguous and ceaselessly flowing quantum soup. It has no material existence other than in your consciousness. Without your consciousness, it would be an energy and information soup.

MH: Without a body to pick up the energy and make something out of it?

DC: Right. What you're hearing now as I'm speaking to you, that sound is created only in your consciousness. In your brain there are only electromagnetic impulses. Isn't it a mystery?! There is no sound in the Universe, it is only the vibration of atmosphere.

MH: What do you mean when you say in your book In Perfect Health that "the body is a river"?

DC: You know, when you look at a river, a river looks the same but it's changing all the time. You cannot step into the same river twice, because new water is always flowing. Your body is like that. It's a river, through a series of physiological things that are called eating, breathing, digesting, metabolism, elimination, and sensory experience. It looks the same, but it is never the same. You have a new liver every six weeks, new skin once a month, a new stomach lining every five days, a new skeleton every three months. You, sitting there listening to this conversation, that body wasn't there a year ago. So if you think you are your material body, you have a bit of a problem! Which one are you talking about?

MH: You have referred to the quantum mechanical human body, and quanta, which you say are the ghosts of energy waiting to take physical form. Would you explain what you mean by that?

DC: Before it's the quantum mechanical body, it's actually the virtual body, which is a word that I don't use in Quantum Healing. As soon as you have a quantum, which is a unit of information and energy, where does it come from? Where does the stuff come from? Again, summon forth a thought. Where was that thought before you had it? So there must be some virtual level of existence which is even pre-quantum. So you can say that there are three levels of existence: virtual, quantum, and physical.

   Physical is easy. You can see it and touch it and bump into it. Even quantum is easy because you experience it in your mind all the time, which is called information and energy. Even the phone call is easy because of the quantum world. I'm speaking to you and what's happening is that the sound I'm making is being converted into electromagnetic impulses that are racing along cable networks, just like along neural networks, so you can hear me. That's the quantum world. But then there must be a pre-quantum world which is the potential for all this, and that you could call the virtual world of existence. Virtual is beyond space and time because it doesn't exist other than as potential. As soon as that potential becomes space-time, then it's already quantum and physical.

MH: Why is it that we tend to be so habit-bound within the physical world?

DC: It is the result of the superstition of materialism. We are very superstitious people, we believe in matter.

MH: Your book The Path to Love is beautifully written and offers a wealth of insights as to what love is and what it isn't. How do we know, especially at the beginning stages of a relationship, that it is real love we are responding to?

DC: Is our inner dialogue about "me," or is it about "you"? Is there communion? That is to say, is there trust, is there respect, is there equality, is there sensitivity, is there truthfulness, is there beauty, is there goodness, is there harmony? If the answer is "yes," then wow! That's love! On the other hand, if I called you and you did not call me back, and I'm mad at you, that's not love.

MH: What is your interpretation of "ego"?

DC: Object referral. It is a bundle of concepts that come about as a result of our identifying ourselves with the objects of our experience. So if you ask somebody on the street, "Who are you?" I don't think the usual response is, "I'm a holographic expression of the Universe, manifesting as a continuum space-time event."

MH: It would be if I met you!

DC: [Laughs] I think that most people start naming the objects of their experience. They'd say, well, I live in Northampton, so I've become Northampton-my name is "X" and I have this bank account. You talk about everything except yourself, and that's ego.

MH: To obtain a higher level of spiritual consciousness does the ego have to be obliterated altogether?

DC: It has to be recognized for what it is. It's my self-image, it is not myself. As long as I don't forget that it is not myself, I'll be fine. If we didn't forget, we'd be doomed to eternal Bliss!

MH: What would you say about the human species' awareness of, and preoccupation with, death and mortality?

DC: We are the only animal that really thinks about death. I think that if you are aware of death, aware that death is stalking you all the time . . . There's an Indian expression, "The Prince of Death." Every time I look over my shoulder, he's nearer. You know, I'm looking over my shoulder right now, and I look over my shoulder a split second later, and he's that much closer. When I'm aware of that, then my life is very magical because my priorities are not trivial and mundane. There's an Indian poem by Tagore-he's talking about death, and he says, "Things that I longed for and I got, let them pass. Let me truly possess the things that I have spurned and overlooked."

MH: What's the best way to get in touch with that part of yourself that doesn't die?

DC: To be aware of that part of yourself that is the witness of the roles you play. To be aware of the experiencer, in the midst of experience. To be aware of eternity in the midst of time. That witnessing awareness is not subject to birth or death.

MH: You mention the term satsang in your book The Path to Love.

DC: Satsang is just a gathering together of people who have the same intention of looking for the truth. It's a conversation and a listening.

MH: Many times people will find themselves in a relationship where each partner has a different spiritual focus, which can create problems. Does this have to be a problem?

DC: If I'm not bent on imposing my focus on yours, it's not a problem. If you really want real love, then allow anyone and everyone to be who they are. Otherwise, don't pretend.

MH: Would you please explain what you mean by Dharma?

DC: It's the natural law. It's also purpose and meaning. It's the Tao, the Way. It's the intent of nature. If I really understand that, even my urge to achieve, my intent, all of that, is the expression of the total Universe. It has nothing to do with me. That's Dharma, to know that. When you know that, you do what you do and don't worry about the fruits of action. You do what you do with the knowingness that you're doing it for God.

MH: Would you say that hate is the flip side of love, or the absence of it?

DC: Hate is an expression of fear, really. When you don't know what to do with your fear, you express it as hate. Hate is the resistance to love, and also the expansion of fear.

MH: I'm interested in the CD called A Gift of Love, which is based on the poems of the poet Rumi. Why did you choose Rumi?

DC: Because I love Rumi, and because I grew up on Rumi. Because Rumi shows the path to God through relationship. Rumi's about freedom, Rumi's about self-knowledge, self-expression. Rumi's about not being afraid. He's also the first Hippie.

MH: How so?

DC: Well, he was free. He lived like a gypsy. He'd stay at different houses each night under the stars.

MH: He was a Sufi, right?

DC: Right, one of the first.

MH: Do you write poetry?

DC: I do. I've done a book called Raid on the Inarticulate.

MH: Regarding your book The Return of Merlin, why did you choose the novel format?

DC: The format allows you to express your innermost fantasies through other people, and also allows you to break free of formal structure. And I think there is a lot more truth in fiction than in non-fiction anyway. When you're writing non-fiction, you're always aware that somebody's watching over your shoulder saying, "Give me your proof." In fiction you say, who cares?

MH: As long as the energy gets through!

DC: That's right. I've done another fiction book called The Way of the Wizard, and there's another one coming out in two months called The Lords of Light.

MH: Are you still actively practicing medicine?

DC: Not in the sense that I see patients, but I do courses for other doctors. I teach a course in mind-body medicine every two months to doctors.

MH: How is that being received?

DC: Oh, it's being received extremely well. I just did a speech at Harvard Medical School on that, and you know, it's very popular in the medical profession. So yeah, they really like it.

MH: The acceptance of the holistic approach in the field of medicine is a relatively new phenomenon, isn't it?

DC: Yes, everything has its season. It doesn't matter, you know? I mean, I'm writing novels and poetry, and if they want to listen to me about mind-body medicine, I'm happy to come. It's fun-yeah, I like to. We all have our little egos.

MH: Speaking of ego, do you have any struggles regarding the fame that you've acquired?

DC: I don't. My family and my kids make sure that I don't.

MH: Do you consider yourself a spiritual teacher? Do you have any devotees, or students?

DC: No. I have students in the sense that a lecturer gives courses, but no, I'm not a guru, if that's what you mean.

MH: I understand that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi was your guru for awhile.

DC: He was my guru for awhile, but then I left him.

MH: Was it because of any limitations that you left?

DC: Yes. Limitations not in him, but limitations in my freedom, yes. I didn't want to be wedded to any one particular ideology or dogma.

MH: You have your roots in Ayurveda, is that correct?

DC: It is. It's influenced me all my life. Through my grandmother, what I saw in India, the inadequacies of a medicine that saw us [doctors] as mere technicians dealing with the human body, rather than understanding the soul as well. So you know, a complex set of circumstances led me to Ayurveda.

MH: How old were you when the connection was made-Western medicine and Ayurveda?

DC: The connection was always there, but I only seriously went into it in 1980, which is nineteen years ago. This is when I became a practicing physician, an endocrinologist.

MH: Is there anything that you would like to add to this interview?

DC: Don't write your article until you listen to the CD [A Gift of Love], because it will get you to experience what I've been talking about.